Planes of Cleavage [14 Consimbs 4385]
Aug. 20th, 2010 07:08 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
sythyryMirrored from Sythyry.
We sat around a fine and brilliantly-polished table of some purple wood or other in Saza’s parlor. We were: Saza, Phaniet, Feralan / hCevian, Vae, and myself.
Saza: “I think that only hCevian, of all of us, can truly appreciate the shape of a spirit. It does not fit nicely in ordinary three-dimensional space.”
hCevian: “I cannot see spirits, save as oblong apprehensions with their own distinctive.”
Me: “Distinctive what?”
hCevain: “Feralan has no word for it.”
Feralan: “hCevian’s thinking of something sort of like an aura, only it’s a texture that moves.”
Saza: “Phaniet, would you do the honors of producing the demonstration spirit model, so that we can contemplate the problem as best as our limited minds allow?”
Phaniet opened the fine wooden box, and brought forth from the thick cheesecloth wrappings the soul-model. It was a glass paperweight, large enough so that Phaniet had to hold it in both hands. Half of it was clear glass (representing Feralan), and half red glass (representing hCevian), with a green dot in the center. The red mostly stayed on one side of the paperweight, and the clear mostly on the other, though a half-dozen fingers and tentacles of each color penetrated into the other.
Saza: “So, what we will be doing is is a spirisection — cutting the agglutinated spirit in half. The basic conditions are simple enough: we need to leave each participant with just about half the spirit, which will be enough to support life, and to heal back to wholeness if not normality. For technical reasons, the plane of cutting needs to go through the center of the sphere — marked by that green dot. The best cuts are generally those which have as much white in one half and as much red in the other as possible, that is, which separate the two spirits as much as possible.”
Phaniet: “If it’s a plane, it’ll slice several of those protrusions.”
Saza: “It is a plane. It will slice several of those protrusions. This is unfortunate. Sythyry could make for us a better scalpel, capable of, in effect, whittling one color off of the other. That would leave one party intact and healthy, but destroy the other.”
hCevian: “I do not volunteer for this destruction!”
Me: “Volunteering would not be strictly required, but we recognize the dangers of holding a pitched battle inside Feralan’s soul. So we are taking the approach that will likely let both of you survive.”
(For the record, we had considered killing hCevian and then doing the whittling approach. However, our best guess was that having a soul merged with yours dying was probably nearly as bad for Feralan as what we were planning — or perhaps worse, since it might destroy him altogether as well. And we felt some responsibility towards poor hCevian.)
Feralan: “So I’m going to lose bits of my spirit, aren’t I?”
Me: “I’m afraid so. So will hCevian.”
Feralan: “I get bits from hCevian, though?”
Me: “And it from you.”
Feralan: “Which bits do I get?”
Saza: “Now that is an excellent question, and one where we have a hard choice to make. Unless I’m missing something, there are two good ways to cut this. One way, along this plane, gives you each the most of your own natural spirit. Unfortunately it severs that protrusion, which corresponds to hCevian’s capacity to appreciate happiness, and that one, which is Feralan’s moral sensibility. The other choice, on that plane, would, I believe, make Feralan’s digestive processes cease to be autonomous, and damages hCevian’s powers of language.”
Me: “That’s not a nice choice.”
hCevian: “There are other choices! Is this diagram accurate?”
Me: “It is accurate as of the spell we just finished a third of an hour ago. Your spirits move around, generally slowly. Of course it is only as accurate as a three-dimensional model of a spirit can be.”
hCevian: “That plane is a possibility, not much worse than the second one. What does it do?”
Saza: “Um … it … chops out a good deal of Feralan’s ability to be empathic, and transfers it to you. It’s not quite balanced.”
hCevian: “A very dangerous thing for me, and not quite fair to Feralan. Consider that plane?”
Saza: “That bisects your ability to … um … maintain some of your vital internal processes. Probably fatal.”
hCevian: “Worse and worse.”
Feralan: “That digestive powers one sounds like the best of bad choices. How would it work though?”
Saza: “You’d have to concentrate some to be able to digest food.”
Feralan: “That sounds annoying, but I guess livable…”
Phaniet: “Wait. That damage would apply in every life, right?”
Saza: “Yes, probably.”
Phaniet: “So, imagine Feralan’s next life. His parents are utterly unprepared for a child with that flaw, and have never heard about it before. Baby-feralan doesn’t know it himself, and doesn’t know how to do it. Which means he starves to death, and his parents none the wiser. Life after life after life, with no hope unless somehow he gets reincarnated with us again and we figure it out. Right?”
Saza: “I hadn’t quite realized that, but yes, it is right.”
Me: “That one won’t do. Are there similar issues with the happiness-and-morality choice, beyond the obvious?”
Phaniet: “The obvious is bad enough! No happiness again, ever, for hCevian! No moral sense, ever, for Feralan!”
Me: “Better than staying joined, though?”
hCevian: “Not better than staying joined. I will endure Feralan’s empathic abilities if he is willing to part with them.”
Feralan: “What does it mean, missing my ability to be empathic?”
Me: “You will have trouble figuring out what people are feeling. Maybe even trouble understanding that they have emotions.”
Feralan: “How bad is that?”
Me: “I have no idea.”
Phaniet: “I couldn’t stand it… but as far as I’m concerned, nobody but Cani really understands other people’s emotions very well anyways.”
Saza: “I don’t think it’d be that terrible. You’ll have to use your mind to figure things out, where ordinarily you’d use your spirit to simply understand.”
hCevian: “I will be the one in trouble. The life of a lesser Power of Locador is one of conflict and battle. Empathy is a serious weakness for such as me!”
Me: “You are asking for our protection?”
hCevian: “I am … I am begging for it.”
Vae: “The crippling from me you have taken! The protection I shall give you, the terrible protection!”
Which sounds fair to me, not that I much want a Locador demon hanging about … even an empathic one.
Me: “So that would seem to be the best choice. “
Saza: “So it would seem. Shall we begin?”
Me: “Tomorrow. Think about it overnight, and see if there are any undiscovered dooms.”
Saza: “Think not overlong! The soul-map is as of this morning; by tomorrow it may have changed in lesser or greater degree!”
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no subject
Date: 2010-08-20 04:27 pm (UTC)Saza is a mentador mage. As such, zie can affect the thoughts and emotions of both Ferelan and hCevian. It is a well-known fact, that thoughts can control the body of a Prime in this world?
Monks of our realm are taught meditations that give them incredible power over their bodies. One of the tests they must pass, it to be brought out into the freezing cold and have their naked bodies covered with a soaking wet blanket. Using naught but the power of their minds, they must not only maintain their warmth, but also dry out the blanket! Observers report clouds of steam rising from the enshrouded monks during this exercise.
Likewise, emotions are very different from thoughts, and where thoughts can influence our bodies, emotions can influence our souls. Emotions such a grief, anger and jealousy can alter our souls in not-nice ways, even damage them for many lifetimes. We have documented instances of warriors from 60 years ago who died in battle, manifesting in children of this age.
In this case, the child's spirit was the reincarnation of a warrior who was trapped in their fighting skyboat as it fell from the sky. It was on fire, and he could not release the canopy to escape. They died screaming in rage and frustration, filled with despair at not being able to go home.
The child manifested this. Nightmares, memories of a life they never lived, knowing the names of people they've never met, even recognizing their faces upon meeting them in person. Voice patterns, behaviors, all of the slain warrior.
The child was unable to have any peace until they visited the site of the battle, and found the place where they'd fallen. There, they said goodbye to what was left of their family, their surviving friends and lovers, and passed on at long last.
Emotions affect the soul. They can tie things to a soul, or help release it.
You have a precious opportunity here for Saza to both learn AND demonstrate the true power of a Mentador Mage. Using her powers, she can accentuate the emotional characteristics of both entities, making them..."brighter", I guess you could say? More distinct. Stronger, even. Then Ferelan and hCevian could be manipulated to enhance the differences between the two.
For example, Ferelan will treasure his empathy, whereas hCevian will abhor it. This could potentially create a much greater separation of the two halves.
The other option, and a potentially interesting one, is to go the opposite route.
Blend the two souls. Make them inseparable.
If they cannot be separated without damaging or killing the other, offer a new route. A new life. Ferelan would cease to be Ferelan, but hCevian would likewise cease to be hCevian. But the new entity would not only have the abilities of a both beings, they would have each other's checks and balances.
I don't know the laws or customs of your world surrounding the creation of new life, but if all else were to fail, and no other options were available, tis' always better to create new life, than to destroy it.
no subject
Date: 2010-08-20 04:29 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-08-20 05:03 pm (UTC)Is there some measure within your society that determines the difference between a Prime and a monster? Is that measure there out of a necessity for the survival of the Prime races?
Or is it there for the convenience of Prime society?
For instance, I should point out that we have monsters within our own culture too? But in contrast, we define ours by their actions, rather than their existence.
Is World Tree society different? And again, is that difference by necessity or convenience?
no subject
Date: 2010-08-20 05:17 pm (UTC)Yes; there are a number of tests, and I suspect Feralan would fail most of them.
Is that measure there out of a necessity for the survival of the Prime races?
Yes, it is; or of individual prime cities, at least.
For instance, I should point out that we have monsters within our own culture too? But in contrast, we define ours by their actions, rather than their existence.
You come from a one-species world, do you not? Presumably species distinctions are less there.
Is World Tree society different? And again, is that difference by necessity or convenience?
Necessity. Or a cautious necessity: we prefer to err on the side of not having horrible beasts perform massacres in our cities.
[Sythyry is pretty liberal on this point, being Vae's friend, correspondant to many offworlders, and all. You seem to have gotten zir into a conservative point of view for the moment. Perhaps zie thinks you are trying to trick zir into something. -bb]
no subject
Date: 2010-08-20 05:48 pm (UTC)The conflict of choice in affections is a societal convenience, not a necessity of survival. At least, not at this stage of your society. So yes, your bard is quite correct? I was trying to trick you into a revealing what I thought would be a conflict of morals versus mores. I understand now, that the conflict does not exist.
Indeed, you are actually creating a potential societal conflict on your own, simply by measure of granting hCevian any consideration at all. Necessity being the driving force it can be, I suspect your fellow primes would consider your mercy to be a weakness or some other failing. They might not care to understand that by granting hCevian such mercy, you are actually increasing your chances of a beneficial outcome.
In that measure, I hope that my offer of encouragement and support is neither unwelcome, nor met with any sense of alarm.
I do try to be a good monster, after all?
no subject
Date: 2010-08-20 06:42 pm (UTC)Thank you!
no subject
Date: 2010-08-20 05:34 pm (UTC)on the other hand, it would probably be a lot better to separate them. Evil mad scientists generally don't come to a good end.
no subject
Date: 2010-08-20 05:35 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-08-20 06:19 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-08-20 08:19 pm (UTC)Now I'm afraid I'm being a bad influence.
I know Nangbang's laissez faire attitude about pants can be distracting at times, but I'm not sure he's that good an influence on you!
no subject
Date: 2010-08-20 08:46 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-08-20 08:46 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-08-20 06:36 pm (UTC)Better than destroying both souls, but not really better than doing some damage to both.
no subject
Date: 2010-08-20 07:54 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-08-20 11:49 pm (UTC)Both tend to change over time anyway. v.v
no subject
Date: 2010-08-20 11:46 pm (UTC)This would definately kill both of them, but they'd probably be okay in their next lives. Assuming the centrifuge worked.